Friday, June 12, 2009

Combat Jack vs. Unkut: EPMD > M.O.P. Pt. 2





















I don't know whether I should be apologizing to or should be angry at some of ya'll. Apologizing in not realizing that a lot of ya'll might be a bit too young to fully appreciate the greatness that was EPMD, not being able to experience first hand how legendary this duo is. Or angry at how (and with no disrespect) ya'll have the nerve to side with Robbie on how M.O.P. outshines Eric and Parrish Making Dollars. Some of ya'll even felt ballsy enough to throw OutKast's name in the ring. No diss to the Atliens, Andre 3000 spits his heat, but I prefer rappers that aren't Dandies. Maybe I'm too old school and gully for rapper dudes to be dressing like Prince. No shots.

But as promised and with no further delay, here are the incontrovertible reasons proof as to why EPMD is the Greatest Hip Hop Duo Of All Time:

1. Four consecutive back to back classic albums.




















Strictly Business dropped the summer of '88. When that other rapper dude was busy moving weight and 1/2 of Mobb Deep was knee deep taking ballerina classes. Some claim that 1988 was the best year for rap albums, especially since that year was crowded with top tier legendary groups like Public Enemy, Boogie Down Productions, Big Daddy Kane, Eric B. & Rakim, N.W.A., Eazy E, Jungle Brothers, Slick Rick, Run-DMC. Ultramagnetic MC's, Too Short, Biz Markie, Ice-T, Stetsasonic, DJ Jazzy Jeff and The Fresh Prince, Kid 'N Play and MC Hammer dropping classic albums. Shit, even rapper chicks like Salt-n-Pepa and MC Lyte were busy getting it in with album heat rocks. Truth be told, when I started hearing "Strictly Business" blasting out of drug dude's Suzuki jeeps and b-boys boom boxes, I was unimpressed, being that I was too deep into BDP and fighting the power with P.E. Plus the fact that my ear was unaccustomed to hearing rappers spit over funk oriented beats. Then there was the duos' seemingly monotonous flow, Parrish Smith coming off a little bit more aggie and battle oriented while Eric Sermon's extra lazy lisp laden flow was more than off putting. Still, the more I listened to the album, the more I was drawn into how the seemingly on surface simple rhymes meshed brilliantly with the funk laced tracks. From the gate, EPMD established themselves as the masters of the funk, even before Dr. Dre, DJ Quick and the rest of the West Coast took over that sound. EPMD also established that they were from this album on, the architects of underground hardcore rap. They built the house that M.O.P. currently resides in. They also kicked off a series of songs about a chick called Jane, a series which would continue throughout their next three albums. Them starting said series in their albums was a first for rap as well as for rock albums. Hailing from Brentwood, Long Island, EPMD proved themselves to be worthy of being counted amongst their fellow rap peers as being on top of their game. Fans didn't lie either. Within 30 days after the album dropped, "Strictly Business" sold over 500,000 units earning the group their first gold plaque. I remember seeing EPMD perform with Public Enemy, Big Daddy Kane, LL Cool J and RUN-DMC down in Washington, DC. It didn't matter that they shared the stage with other rap icons, EPMD made sure they left an effin smoking crater where they stood, just to let both peers and fans know that they were no effin joke. And not with having 100 of they man's an' em clutter the stage like so many of today's so-called cRap acts do. Nah, these dude was official. Go ahead and cop that. Listen to this bitch right here with no interruptions and tell me I'm lying. I dare you.





















Unfinished Business, their second album, dropped in 1989 and came out fucking swinging. Once the bass from the first cut "So Wat' Cha Sayin'" bangs, it was clear that these dudes amped up that booom bap hardcore shit. That song's beat was one of the hardest, and at this point Eric Sermon and Parrish Smith cold mushed the sophomore jinx in the face by demonstrating that at this point, they had mastered their whole slow flow show. Not only had their delivery and production improved, but dudes managed to remain thoroughly hard core whilst at the same time feeling completely comfortable in showing how funny they could be. Tracks like "Please Listen To My Demo" had listeners laughing as the group walked fans through how they ended up getting a record deal and going from broke unknowns to the rap superstars that they were. In addition to the back and forth exchange and chemistry, dudes proves to be adept at story telling as well. So comfortable in their hardcore underground persona, Eric Serman p/k/a "The Green Eyed Bandit" let it be known that in the midst of slaying sucker emcees and busting caps, he was prone to break out in song mid rhyming. One of the stand out cuts is "Knick Knack Patty Wack" featuring the first of many dope rappers EPMD would discover and put on. Guest starring K-Solo, a rapper who killed game by spelling out words in his raps, the three traded verses and mics as they killed the beat bloody. It didn't matter even that K-Solo misspelled the word "bird" as "b-r-i-d", the song still rocked. The weakest song on the album "You Had Too Much To Drink", featuring a cheesy '80s electro rock sounding beat still comes off with the comedy as the duo drops a cautionary tale about drinking and driving. Guaranteed to be one of the funniest rap songs ever. Like "Strictly Business", "Unfinished Business" sold over 500,000 units, earning the group their second gold album. Cop this album as well and tell me it ain't a classic.





















How ill is the cover to Business As Usual, (1990) their 3rd album? Already managed by Russell Simmons' superstar management company RUSH Management, this album was their Def Jam debut. Signed initially to Sleeping Bag Records, the group was at this point, widely recognized as being unfuckwitable as far as being on top of their rap craft. Once the record company folded, it was a no brainer for Def Jam to sign them as they had already proven themselves to be rap superstars. Having famed comic book artist Bill Sienkiewicz illustrate the album cover further proved that EPMD was now certified as being in the big leagues, bigger budget and all. Still, the group maintained their hard-core underground aura with tracks like "I'm Mad", "Hardcore" and "Underground". So authentic were they that other rap icons pledged allegiance or claimed to be down with them. Most evident of this was rap legend LL Cool J who realized he desperately needed EPMD in his life in order to extend his rap shelf life. Featured on the track "Rampage", LL spits like he's so happy to be down and appear on the track with EPMD. Around this time, he also cops a bit of Parrish Smith's slow flow battle rap style and it shows on his own classic album "Momma Said Knock You Out", especially on the cut "To The Break On Dawn", which featured a brand new LL sounding very much like Parrish, the Mic Doc's student. Not deviating from their prior albums, EPMD continued to bring their brand of funk, gully, story telling and pure dopeness to fans ever hungry for more. Another highlight is on the track "Hardcore" which finds the group introducing the latest member to their growing posse, a young and very deadly Reggie Noble p/k/a "Redman". Like the first two, this album ended up selling over 500,000 units earning the group their third gold plaque. At this point, are some of ya'll still even considering M.O.P. as even being equals? Grab this up, let it bang on your cerebellum some, then let me know if you still wanna maintain such blasphemous thoughts.






















Business Never Personal, (1992) the group's fourth album was with no question, the hardest one they dropped. Darker than the prior three and clocking in as their shortest (under 40 minutes), this was true black hoodie rap at its best. Maintaining underground status, EPMD took more creative chances with their story telling and concepts. "Who Killed Jane" proved to be the best of the series. "Headbanger" once again featuring Redman cemented these dudes as the best in the hardcore genre. "Cummin' At Cha" featured another collabo with the latest members of their squad, Das-Efx. Short and sweet, this album sadly resulted in the end of the EPMD era as the group disbanded shortly after it dropped, due to infighting, reportedly over money. As producer of most of the groups material, Eric Serman had been receiving the lion's share of dollars and allegedly both members of the group were allegedly involved with gun play and violence towards each other. Fucked up shit!!! Even though they would later put aside their differences and regroup in 1997, "Business As Usual" proved to be the group's last classic album, the fourth of four consecutive stellar joints. Like the prior three, this album also went on to sell over 500,000 units, earning the group their fourth gold album. Few duos kept it as gully, as hardcore, as underground as EPMD while at the same time getting their commercial props on. Peep the album here. Then let me know who in your top whatever ever dropped four consecutive classic albums in a row. Other than maybe A Tribe Called Quest, all I'm hearing is crickets. I took a drive from New York to Ohio several years ago with my former business partner. On the way down, I decided to play the four albums from front to back and back to back. By the time we landed in Ohio, dude was like, "wow, I didn't realize EPMD were that dope." No kidding asshole. As fires as they are, there's no way I'm listening to four M.O.P. albums back to back. Them dudes scream so much hardcore that I might end up cold punching my moms dead in her mouth. And that's where the genius in EPMD lay. As other groups straight strained their vocals to position themselves as being all rough, tough and stuff, these dudes did it on that mellow tip, jokes, singing and all. Everyone still knew they might get shot if you tested them. I lay the greatness of their albums out for you here. Feel free to play them all front to back and back to back. Then get at me. I'm waiting.

2. Showmanship Like I mentioned earlier, these cats knew how to rock a show. I saw them several times and they always killed it. Small venues as well as large arenas like Madison Square Garden. Didn't matter. They always delivered. Peep this lil clip here and tell me M.O.P. can do this shit. Rap, dance, breath control and maintenance of gully. Go head, show me. Dudes were true masters on stage and as a customer, you knew you were always going to get your monies' worth.

3. Impact On The Genre Not only did they build the house that hardcore underground rappers like M.O.P. claim, EPMD also affected the language that rappers and fans alike spoke. Phrases like "Audi 5000", "Swayze", "Ghost" are stiil used in certain circles of this here rap thing. That's crazy being able to add slanguage to a peoples' vernacular. EPMD did it several times, and with ease. They were that dope.

4. Rap Spin-offs K-Solo, Das-Efx, Redman, Keith Murray. At the end of the day, EPMD alone remains responsible for introducing us to a slew of incredible artists. All I'm counting from M.O.P.'s end is Teflon. And he's awright.

5. Most Influential I can go on an on, but I'll end this here. Guaranteed, ask your favorite rap duos out, M.O.P. and OutKast included, who influenced them the most. Other than Run-DMC and maybe a couple of others, I can bet they'll all say EPMD. Ask Robbie even, as he goes in and continues to kill the game in them exclusive interviews he drops over at Unkut. Ask him to start asking rappers who influenced them, who fathered their style, who made them wanna be as dope as they wanna be, most cats will say without hesitation, EPMD. I see him at Unkut throwing jokes about the group's history, about their storied break-up, abot how Eric Sermon jumped out the window, literally, and how he stays as a prime suspect over at the Pause Police. But in the end, how relevant is all that extraneous activty when compared to the legacy that the group left us with? Like comparing apples to oranges.

Not trying to come off preachy, but not trying to let shit fall through the cracks, give this group the effin respect and credit they deserve. EPMD remains the best rap duo of all time, bar none.

This was a Combat Jack, Daily Mathematics Public Service Announcement.

Blaow!




58 comments:

  1. "Like comparing apples to oranges"

    ^ Sure, but apples don't try and eff dudes in the A.

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  2. forget the fruit talk
    EPMD for the win

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  3. My vote's still for Mo P's, but you proved your point. Well done, Jack.

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  4. Can we talk about how "So Whatcha Sayin" is the best rap track of all time?
    Great job, Jack.

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  5. I'll never forget the first time I heard It's My Thing on the radio- them helicopters come in -wtf? - and then the beat drops - it was over

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  6. Couldn't have said it better myself...

    EPMD for the win...

    BTW - I lost it on the "No kidding asshole."

    Great Drop...

    THE EMPLOYEES OF THE YEAR NOW WE'RE BACK TO WORK!

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  7. EPMD is better than MOP... MOP have half of one good album. SORRRRYYY...

    But your disqualification of Outkast is preposterous and lame. They are better than EPMD and you're gonna have to actually bring some sonic evidence to convince me otherwise.

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  8. EPMD kills MOP....Its not even close. At the end of the day though....OutKast FTW.

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  9. P.S.
    You couldn't tell me I wasn't Erick Sermon when I was a kid....

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  10. Another example of White trying to pass off mediocre one-dimensional rappers as legendary. White stays doing this on the Internets (see Noz, Soderberg)saying Gucci Mane is Jesus or some shit.

    Without EPMD, there's no M.O.P. Without M.O.P...uh, nobody would give a shit if they existed or not.

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  11. dmitry aka brooklyn jewJune 15, 2009 at 10:12 AM

    Ok VERY good argument, but still no one is even mentioning Gangstarr, combatjack c'mon man u know hip-hop, without gangstarr der would be a piece missing from hip-hop.And please nobody tell me they r not a duo beacuse a duo consists of two members in a group. Wats a tough track made of a tough beat and nice lyrics. Guru provides dat tough rhyming flow and premo provides dat golden beat. Who agrees wit me, combatjack would'nt u agree wit me from one brooklyn guy to da other.

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  12. Guru is average at best.......And Primo is overrated! He's been making the same beat for 10 years!

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  13. dmitry aka brooklyn jewJune 15, 2009 at 11:02 AM

    ok datoine look im saying dat dey make each other better dey feed off each other dats wat made em so great. Indivually der good but not Gangstarr Great. Dey been in da game since 85'. Dats before epmd which was like 86' and way before MOP which was like 92'. Listen to dem together as gangstarr from start to finish, not as guru and premo indivually.

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  14. Even their graphic design is influencial. peep Just Blaze's blog.

    M.O.P... really, just stop it. That's like comparing the Magic to the Lakers. Orlando put together a good but brief run and hung with heavyweights (hard singles). But this year was clearly a fluke. (one good album).

    Sounds like some Brownsville boys' run in the mid-90s no?

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  15. Second Round K.O.
    Combat Jack FTW

    Killed it!! Not that there was any doubt in the beginning..but still..that was manslaughter

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  16. forgot to add..

    EPMD always had the freshest videos...that Golddigger video...you gots to chill sittin in the cold house, so whatcha sayin in the gully..damn it...
    EPMD >>>>>>>> ANYONE

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  17. OUTKAST is still better than both of these guys. and im gonna prove it.

    EPMD > MOP any day of the week.

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  18. These are great albums, but The Infamous >> everything. If that were the only album they ever put out, they'd still be the best duo of all time.

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  19. EPMD tears it down, hands down.
    Gangstarr is dope but don't come close to Eric and Parrish. Preemo is not over-rated tho.
    Outkast comes in second but CJ pretty much solidifies, gives every reason why EPMD is the dopest duo of all time. I saw them last summer at the Nokia NYC... they still had it. Their time was too short for them to knock out all their hits..
    LOL @ 1/2 of MOBB knee deep in ballerina classes. Though like someone said in the previous post: Shook Ones might be the gulliest track of all time.

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  20. I prefer rappers that aren't Dandies. Maybe I'm too oldschool and gully for rapper dudes to be dressing like Prince. No shots.
    ^^^^
    Ironically, your reasoning for why Outkast isn't the best is basically Robbie's reasoning for why MOP are better than EPMD...extraneous activities indeed.

    In other words, your argument against Outkast is weak...and I think it has alot to do with nostalgia and your Eastcoast regional prejudice...not saying that you hate South shit..hust saying that you have a bias in favor of that ol' Eastcoast sound

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  21. I agreed with ya'll anyway but excellent points, CJ, especially catching K-Solo "b-r-i-d," hah.

    I will take an unpopular position (ll), however, and stand up for Prodigy over Jay-Z. I mean, look at the dancers in the EPMD clip you posted! If Shawn was REALLY as smart as he wants us to believe, he could have gone hard against sickle cell P without digging up some jive-ass kid photos.

    Meanwhile, "Brooklyn Nets" (sic) are where again, Mr. Minority Owner (in more ways than one)?

    Music history sidenote: Prodigy's grandfather, Budd Johnson, was a major jazz musician of the 1920s-70s; I bet some of the Stetsasonic dudes knew!

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  22. ^^^Lol @Willis mentioning the Brooklyn Nets

    Isn't Prodigy in Jail? Case closed.

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  23. Correction: Never-to-be Brooklyn Nets, with Jay the patsy frontman. Sure, he can hold his small % long enough to make some $$$, fine, but acting (rapping) like he's "the owner..." The real Nets owner and arena developer was THRILLED to have Jay's investment group join-- if only to quiet some of the "community" protest because it's such a shady deal (TONS of NYC & State corruption). If Lebron James ever becomes a Net I'll eat this post.

    The Nets also dug up New York Knicks great and Fort Hamilton H.S. hero Bernard King to front for 'em too but pushed his ass faaaaaar away when he got caught up in some wife beating ** allegations. **

    http://www.majorwager.com/forums/mess-hall/23605-bernard-king-arrested-spousal-abuse.html

    Dunno how it turned out for Bernard but it shows you the quality of the people Jay is playing with.

    (Apologies for the politics of sports digression.)

    And no, of course, Prodigy is a knucklehead in jail while Jay is free to sign Drake and do lousy guest verses with Rick Ross. I'm just saying that, to that point, Prodigy was a superior artist and that the ballet thing was just silly... Unless he was trying to imply some Alvin Ailey (ll) ish... which would be mean as hell but I doubt it was that layered.

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  24. Recapping this entry and the comment section, here's my views:

    *Outkast aren't Dandies, LOL... they're just wildly different than most. Not quite De La Soul, just not EPMD/MOP-ish.

    *Business As Usual is really a slept-on incredible album.

    *GangStarr hasn't been around since '85, they've been out since '89.

    *Yes, Premier HAS been making the same beat for 10 years.

    *Teflon Who?

    *Prodigy doesn't even have control over what time of day he takes a shower, much less his career. Jay on the other hand is practically running his own ship at this point. I'm just sayin'.

    *And yes, EPMD is CLEARLY above and beyond M.O.P. on all the points as mentioned by Jack. Was there ever a doubt?

    -D!

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  25. Great post Jack
    and i think that any real hip hop dude with any kind of knowledge of the history knows that EPDM shits on MOP ... i think Robbie knows that too he just needed some attention to his site or something... His Unkut site always been dope so im a bit suprised. You cant compare an ok rapgroup wit legends thats not even fair and im convinced that MOP themself would say EPMD hands down.

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  26. effin newjacks get links to some of the illest hip hop ever made and still they wet... im behind this post 100%--let em know man... you cant even fuck with these 4 albums... NEXT!

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  27. CJ,

    You did it again, great post. EMPD is the best two man rap group ever. If they are not better than Run-DMC, they are neck and neck with them. The Mash Out Posse is dope, but they can't even make your top 5 once you start talking about De La, Tribe, Naughty, Jungle Brothers and Outkast. Those groups changed hip hop. They had dudes changing their rhyme style up, the way they dressed, spoke, the music they rapped over; Jazz, Rock, Funk and House music. The first time I heard "It's My Thing" this kid on my block was blasting that shit on his boom box, it was Red Alert on 98.7, he was scracthing the hell out that record. The helicopter then the bass drop, that shit was so dope. That was the day I became a hip hop junkie.

    I hope I don't see a post with dudes claiming Super Lover Cee and Cassanova Rud are better than Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince or some shit like that; I can hear somebody now yelling Ill Al Skacth would kill Nice N Smooth in a battle... get the fuck outta hear with that BS.

    Also, I remember that Rap mania concert. It was on pay per view back in 1990 or 91'. Eric B and Rakim, EPMD, Run-DMC, Sugar Hill was on that joint. I think Ice-T, BWP and Def Jef rocked on their as well. Remember Def Jef, he had the girl Dee form the video show "Pump it Up" in his video. I think she was a rapper also. I think Dr. Dre slapped her during an interview or something crazy like that. If you got that on tape or know where to get a copy, get at me. Peace.

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  28. Great Post - I saw EPMD perform at Black August concert last year and they tore it down. They were also responsible for DJ Scratch.

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  29. Bladow indeed!
    On point once again with one small correction.It was Parrish Smith who as Executive producer was the point of contention of E Dub and the other Hit Squad artists.There was a show or a beef DVD (not sure which) I saw where they did a segment on this.E Dub did the beats but P was handling ALL of the buisiness.Cats broke in P's crib and tied up his folks when he wasn't there and a suspect who was arrested allegedly said E was involved.Real shit. Glad they could eventually dead that but it was never the same.

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  30. EPMD wins, if only on account of the fact that they had the good taste of employing God Bill Sienkiewicz as a cover artist. That, and endless classic albums.
    Maybe they aged less nicely than MOP, but the EPMD legacy is unfuckwithable (or so they say).
    CJ wins again.

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  31. Between MOP and EPMD? I gotta go with EPMD. The hardcore in their music was effortless. Throw in DJ SCRATCH with his Funky Piano cuts and it's end of discussion.

    Seriously though, I've seen a store get looted in broad daylight--slow-mo style--to You're a Customer. EPMD all day.

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  32. @Frost In the book Rakim Told Me, PMD is quoted as saying that the helicopter was hovering outside when they were trying to record. Sounded good so they left it on the track!

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  33. EPMD are and forever will be my favourite two man MC team, they have influenced so many artists and gave us Redman, Das EFX and K-Solo, M.O.P. are dope, but they are not legends like Erick and Parrish are

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  34. dmitry aka brooklyn jewJune 16, 2009 at 7:20 AM

    ok danjlovesthe90's ur right and wrong. Gangstarr was formed in 85' by Guru and two no name producers one of dem named mike dee, no relations to da beastie boy. Dat same year Gangstarr broke up and da remaing member was Guru den Guru sent a demo tape to premo and premo hooked up wit Guru and da Gangstarr we know of today was born. Releasing der debut album in 89' wit no more mr. nice guy. So i guess ur technically right

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  35. dmitry aka brooklyn jewJune 16, 2009 at 7:27 AM

    But overall Combat jack provides a GREAT argument. I just prefer Gangstarr more den EPMD i think Robbie from unkut provides a good argument too but hes way in over his head, i love EPMD, but think Gangstarr is more superior beacuase every single album dey had was just pure quality even da ownerz.

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  36. ok outkast comes in close 2nd primarily due to point #5. no doubt kast was influenced by e&p. anybody around in 88 had to be. me and my boys changed our style up after strictly biz just like cool j. we started talkin mad shit about crushing wack mcs.
    yep. bit on the whole bait. (no e.sermon)

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  37. Plus lets not forget style-- EPMD popularized the fishermen cap! mop and mob deep dint have anything going on visually-just beats and rhymes. epmd brought the whole package.
    vg mr jack.

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  38. Sure, EPMD is waaay better than M.O.P. M.O.P os still dope. But: Eric B and Rakim? Pete Rock & CL Smooth? Show & AG? Organized Konfusion? And thats just a few of the good shit that havnt been mentioned yet. Still: EPMD maybe is the greatest ever to do it.

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  39. Listen: these young cats who say MOP > EPMD are buggin'! It's not even close and shouldn't really have even been up for discussion, frankly and I'm surprised you even indulged Robbie on this, Reggie. But you know what? I think they have a point on Outkast being the greatest ever. The first four EPMD albums are all classics, incredible etc. but Outkast is on another level as far as all elements of their music are concerned: verbals, spit game, concepts, songwriting, production etc.

    And finally, I hate to admit it but using your framework for arguing for EPMD, I think if you asked around, more new groups and artists, ESPECIALLY in the South and the midwest were actually influenced (for better or worse) by Outkast than ever were by EPMD.

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  40. Wow. Great post. I haven't listened to EPMD in a minute.

    Like most have said here already, I think it's a given who's more legendary and influential. I guess Robbie's side of the argument dwells more on his personal tastes.

    Great blog too, btw. Now I gotta go bump these classics!

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  41. that helicopter is a rock record....cmon now

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  42. Wait a minute!!
    WAIT A FUCKIN MINUTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    HOW IN THE FUCK IS MOP EVEN IN THIS CONVERSATION??
    I swear to God - I have been on hip-hop non-stop since about '87. I have heard almost every album that made it above ground and a lot of the underground.
    THE ONLY M.O.P. SONG I'VE EVER HEARD IS "ANTE UP"
    And that shit wasn't cold. I'm tired of hearing about these niggas like they fit in with the legends.
    I'm sorry to inform niggas but that's some LOCAL NEW YORK SHIT.
    I repeat THEM NIGGAS IS LOCAL.
    Stop talking about them niggas like they ever sold 1,000 copies outside of New York.
    Nobody knows them niggas.

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  43. HERE IS THE GREATEST DUO NOBODY REMEMBERS!!
    THE FIRST INTERRACIAL DUO !
    CHECK YOUTUBE: DOWNTOWN SCIENCE- ROOM TO BREATHE

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  44. EPMD IS HARDCORE RAPPING. BUT THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING SCARY ABOUT ERICK AND PARRISH. IF I SAW THEM IN THE STREET AT 3 AM WITH A STACK ON ME, I WOULDN'T CROSS THE STREET.
    MOP IS HARDCORE RAPPING FROM HARDCORE MOTHERFUCKAS! IF I SAW EITHER OF THEM OR EVEN WORSE, BOTH OF THEM, DAY OR NIGHT, I'M JETTIN THE OTHER WAY.
    Whether you agree or not, believability adds to a rappers resume. You fuckin best believe danze or fame wouldn't hesitate to slap the ever living shit outta you if you get out of line.
    ONE MORE THING, to the idiot above me saying he's been "hip hop non stop" (who says that?) since '87 and he's only heard ante up. KILL YOURSELF! but i would love to see you say that to them

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  45. ONE MORE THING, DETROIT P JUST DROPPED THE REALEST COMMENT IN THIS SHIT:
    I prefer rappers that aren't Dandies. Maybe I'm too oldschool and gully for rapper dudes to be dressing like Prince. No shots.
    ^^^^
    Ironically, your reasoning for why Outkast isn't the best is basically Robbie's reasoning for why MOP are better than EPMD...extraneous activities indeed.

    In other words, your argument against Outkast is weak...and I think it has alot to do with nostalgia and your Eastcoast regional prejudice...not saying that you hate South shit..hust saying that you have a bias in favor of that ol' Eastcoast sound

    IF YOU HATE ON OUTKAST FOR BEING SOFT AND NOT BY THEIR MUSIC, THAN MOP IS ON A WHOLE 'NOTHER LEVEL THAN EPMD.

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  46. PMD coined the term "underground" (Source Magazine 1993 interview) and the formation of the Hit Squad laid the blueprint for what Wu-Tang accomplished (they even admit that themselves).

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  47. See just like my argument that Jay won the battle with Nas. Because Nas resorted to name calling and childish bullshit while Jay spoke facts about dudes career at that point...

    Its the same situation here...MOP no doubt a great duo but not the greatest....EPMD got them beat by a mile...

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  48. EPMD and it aint even close

    Although I only consider their first 3 albums classic, it still trumps anything MOP has done. MOP has no classic albums (a classic song - sure). Outkast got 1 classic album (ATLiens) and thats it. ATCQ, De La, EPMD, and PE should be the only groups in the convo for best rap group of all time (fuck a duo - EPMD bigger than that)

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  49. I thought Robbie made a good argument for M.O.P, but honestly I never felt like there was ever even a comparison. EPMD has whole CLASSIC albums ou the gate...the first two are damn near interchangeable....they spawned whole crews of MCs.....I can't even call EPMD legends, they're Icons who spawned legends.......M.O.P is a solid duo with a classic sound but the BEST M.O.P album(they're third in my opinion) still pales in comparison to EPMD's 1st 4 albums...........and these are 2 of my favorite GROUPs who put on two of the best shows I ever saw.

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  50. Next post - best rapping producer:

    Q-Tip or DJ Quik?

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  51. Yo u heard your man Kedar beat an off duty cop up?

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  52. Yo Combat Jack oyu almost forgot EPMD also had one of the baddest DJ's to ever scratch a record, the legendary DJ Scratch from Albany Projects in where? BROOKLYN baby!

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  53. I'm wack for this but I didn't even read the whole post to comment...the first paragraph got me hot...EPMD was hot as hell...and newbies be thinkin' that what passes for rap these days is some EXTRA bullshit.

    Old sckool will ALWAYS RULE!

    *ummm, that's just my buck 56...
    and now I will go back to reading the pist...ummm, maybe*

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  54. *that was "post"...and that was "what passes for rap now is bullshit*

    Yes, I must learn to type or spell...hell both...lol

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  55. Personally I've always felt EPMD's "Scratch Bring It Back/Mic Doc" was the hardest song ever made - Two of the dopest, hardest boom-bapiness beats you'll ever hear and all in one song.

    "Record mode switch the EQ to Dolby, step back check yourself punk, you dont know me"

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  56. Thank you man, thank you! For all the young headz and those with amnesia.

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  57. Ay Yo!!! this was really up for debate?? Dudes just do not get it!!! If you lived it, you completely understand....... If not?!! get the BOZACK!!!!! I remember throwin that first tape (M.O.P)out the window of my mans Legend ... right on the street(Jerome) to be exact, up in the BX....
    dudes micro-debating evy' thang!!!

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